#8051154 - 01/19/15 09:31 AM
Embarking on quite the journey, ver. life
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SuPeR-MaRiO
Post Master Sr
Registered: 06/28/01
Posts: 6241
Loc: Toronto, Ontario
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I’ll start off by saying this, I find there aren’t too many different types of people when it comes to children. Typically people love them, hate them, or are indifferent (even those with kids). I will say that I do love kids.
I have 2 kids (4.5 and 2.5 yrs old). Not many people have more than 2 kids these days. It turns out, I have 2 more on the way (twins). While we are happy and pray that they are healthy, my wife and I can’t stop thinking of how drastically our lives will change.
We have been looking at the possibility of moving for a while now and while it makes sense to put that on hold, there are also many reasons to go ahead with it. Thinking back to a few homes that we passed on and regretted, it’s a good thing we didn’t pull the trigger on them.
So many things running through our minds regarding everyday life routines, things aren’t going to get any easier with four kids.
I will obviously need a minivan now. An SUV with a third row is a good option for when they are out of car seats, but for now I will need access to the third row to buckle/strap in two of them, so minivan is the only option. Additionally, I will probably need 2 minivans. If one parent is dropping off the kids, the other will need a vehicle to pick them up in. This can probably wait until my wife goes back to work though.
Speaking of which, many people assume that my wife will stop working now. Unfortunately, no. Not only does she have a great job with a pension and amazing benefits (for our growing family), but we’re going to need her income now, especially with the changes that are upcoming. She will however take an extended (unpaid) leave of absence, most likely longer than the ones she took for the first two kids.
Another thing we have been contemplating is a nanny, who will be able to help not only with the twins but with other chores, drop offs, pickups etc. My preference is a live-out, but those are $$$, but at the same time I don’t know if I really want a live-in who for the most part, will always be there.
We’re also looking at fixing our basement before the twins arrive in the summer. The extra space will of course be beneficial but will also provide my older two with a place to run amuck while we care for the babies. But before we set forth with fixing the basement we need to iron out the nanny dilemma and determine if we need an extra room down there.
Anyone keeping a tab on these additional costs?
Ok I won’t bore you guys anymore, as these are just a fraction of the things that run through my head all day every day. I expect the usual “you’re f*cked” comments, but if anyone has any words of encouragement, advise or personal experience, I’m all ears. I believe there are a few on here with 3 kids and even twins (Big Tasty), not sure if anyone has 4 though.
C/N: Have two kids. Expecting two more. Life's gonna change.
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#8051173 - 01/19/15 09:41 AM
Re: Embarking on quite the journey, ver. life
[Re: SuPeR-MaRiO]
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JEFFOS
Post Master Supreme
Registered: 01/27/00
Posts: 29176
Loc: Toronto
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Big changes and you life will change big time but if you're going to make big life changes what better reason than for your kids/family?
Edit and you can play all kinds of tricks on people if the twins are identical.
Edited by JEFFOS (01/19/15 09:42 AM)
_________________________
-Jeff
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#8051192 - 01/19/15 09:51 AM
Re: Embarking on quite the journey, ver. life
[Re: JEFFOS]
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furball
Post Master Sr
Registered: 09/24/03
Posts: 9551
Loc: Toronto, ON
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That's a huge change.... Some thoughts/experience as I see these things from a diff perspective: a buddy has 2 kids, live-in nanny, and one of a friend has 2 kids still young.
1) Keep the career going
- There's no need to have the wife sit idle and just be a stay-at-home mom, no matter how much she makes, or whether she has a career vs a job. The point is, she will continue to grow/maintain her skills, versus being out of the workforce. Even if you break-even with the wife working and the costs of a nanny ....
- Case in point: I know someone who stayed at home as a mommy for 10+ years. Just got divorced, and she's fucked. She gave up everything including almost completing a financial designation... It's all gone, and she's looking at entry-level jobs. Even her MS Office skills are shot.
2) 2 mini vans?
- You'll have to think this through, but wouldn't that mean you'll need up to 8 car seats?
3) Nanny
- Not sure if a nanny can handle 4 kids total, let alone twins. Some can't. It's just nuts. (Yes, the first year your wife will be home, but imagine the year after.)
- Ballpark price for live-in from what my friend told me is $1200-1800/month for a flip nanny, much cheaper than I thought. She's a live-in, and he gives her other perks such as giving her a free metro-pass on weekends, and a bunch of costco snacks, etc, provides her with a tv + notebook for surfing.
- She just so happens to also cook a batch of food once/wk, and also cleans the powder room.
- He lives at Yonge/Finch, so it's not like he's in the middle of nowhere. (i.e. nanny can go about her business on her off hours.) IIRC he also sometimes drops her off at the train station/etc ...
- Nanny leaves on Friday evening, and comes back Sunday, i.e. she's paying for her own shared place on the side.
- IIRC, nanny starts at about 8am (takes the kids to school?), and stops at about 6pm (i.e. he has to rush home.)
- Kids are usually fed by the time they get home ... Kids are like 6 and 10 IIRC. I think they sometimes walk home from school on their own .. 
- One of the kids picked up a Filipino accent for a bit 
- After fixing the flip accent, the kid picked up a Viet accent and started squating (thank the dude's wife for that) ... my buddy freaked out
Edited by furball (01/19/15 10:02 AM)
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#8051215 - 01/19/15 10:03 AM
Re: Embarking on quite the journey, ver. life
[Re: furball]
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SuPeR-MaRiO
Post Master Sr
Registered: 06/28/01
Posts: 6241
Loc: Toronto, Ontario
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That's a huge change.... Some thoughts/experience as I see these things from a diff perspective: a buddy has 2 kids, live-in nanny, and one of a friend has 2 kids still young. 1) Keep the career going - There's no need to have the wife sit idle and just be a stay-at-home mom, no matter how much she makes, or whether she has a career vs a job. The point is, she will continue to grow/maintain her skills, versus being out of the workforce. Even if you break-even with the wife working and the costs of a nanny .... - Case in point: I know someone who stayed at home as a mommy for 10+ years. Just got divorced, and she's fucked. She gave up everything including almost completing a financial designation... It's all gone, and she's looking at entry-level jobs. Even her MS Office skills are shot. 2) 2 mini vans? - You'll have to think this through, but wouldn't that mean you'll need up to 8 car seats? 3) Nanny - Not sure if a nanny can handle 4 kids total, let alone twins. Some can't. It's just nuts. (Yes, the first year your wife will be home, but imagine the year after.) - Ballpark price for live-in from what my friend told me is $1200-1800/month for a flip nanny, much cheaper than I thought. She's a live-in, and he gives her other perks such as giving her a free metro-pass on weekends, and a bunch of costco snacks, etc, provides her with a tv + notebook for surfing. - She just so happens to also cook a batch of food once/wk, and also cleans the powder room. - He lives at Yonge/Finch, so it's not like he's in the middle of nowhere. (i.e. nanny can go about her business on her off hours.) IIRC he also sometimes drops her off at the train station/etc ... - Nanny leaves on Friday evening, and comes back Sunday, i.e. she's paying for her own shared place on the side. - IIRC, nanny starts at about 8am (takes the kids to school?), and stops at about 6pm (i.e. he has to rush home.) - Kids are usually fed by the time they get home ... Kids are like 6 and 10 IIRC. I think they sometimes walk home from school on their own ..
1) Yes we've thought about it and while it would be beneficial in the beginning, when she is ready to go back, it won't be easy to get that same job back. I feel sorry for that lady you know who stayed at home for 10+ years and is now divorced 
2) Yes sir, 8 car seats. Combination of bucket seats, toddler and at some point booster.
3) From what I have been told live-ins are approx. $1300-1500 and live-outs are $2000-$2400. The very important thing to remember is that this is their take home pay, in other words it is costing the homeowner more due to paying taxes, so its more like $1500-2000 and $2500-3000
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#8051225 - 01/19/15 10:09 AM
Re: Embarking on quite the journey, ver. life
[Re: Screamin' Type-R]
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4Three
Post Master Sr
Registered: 12/21/00
Posts: 5378
Loc: Markham, ON, Canada
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Kids are a blessing, and while 4 will be a handful and test your patience, I'm sure you'll be fine. My cousin has 4 and she's fine, except for that fact that when I look in her eyes, I no longer see a soul. Congrats. 
Seriously tho, the most important thing is to ask for help and accept help. I can't do either of those things myself (and I only have 2 kids), and I'm often stressed and miserable. Not miserable because of my kids, just bummed about the stress. The funny shit they say and do is what helps me thru the misery.
_________________________
Fake right, cross-over, shoot lefty
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#8051237 - 01/19/15 10:14 AM
Re: Embarking on quite the journey, ver. life
[Re: 4Three]
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SuPeR-MaRiO
Post Master Sr
Registered: 06/28/01
Posts: 6241
Loc: Toronto, Ontario
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Kids are a blessing, and while 4 will be a handful and test your patience, I'm sure you'll be fine. 
My cousin has 4 and she's fine, except for that fact that when I look in her eyes, I no longer see a soul. Congrats.
Seriously tho, the most important thing is to ask for help and accept help. I can't do either of those things myself (and I only have 2 kids), and I'm often stressed and miserable. Not miserable because of my kids, just bummed about the stress. The funny shit they say and do is what helps me thru the misery.
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#8051271 - 01/19/15 10:27 AM
Re: Embarking on quite the journey, ver. life
[Re: 4Three]
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Big Tasty
Post Master Supreme
Registered: 02/10/02
Posts: 20020
Loc: Toronto
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First thing, sign up here: https://tpomba.wildapricot.org/ They are a wealth of knowledge in dealing with twins/triplets..etc. It is very different having twins than having children close together.
We did the nanny thing for a bit, it is very helpful having someone come in before you leave for work to "take over the child management". You do what you need to up to a point and they just take over while you go. Coming home is less hectic as well as the kids are already home, dinner is made or prepped and the house is somewhat clean. We ended up switching to daycare as the kids needed more socialization than what they got with the few drop in programs each day and was better for our older child too.
One thing on this though, don't expect the nanny to do shit you yourself can't do in a day...ie keep them engaged, take others to school/drop in, do laundry, mop floors prep dinner, clean house all at the same time.
If you are doing the nanny thing above board (or semi above) and paying taxes then try these guys https://www.waveapps.com/payroll/. You enter the hourly pay, hours worked in the week and they will break out all the taxes to deduct as well as the extra you yourself have to pay. They will also give you a receipt to print out for the nanny and another for you to pay to the gov. Think it's like $5/mth last I used them.
If you decide to go the daycare route, try applying for subsidy. They take in consideration families of twins/triplets to give you a bit of a discount. You won't be paying peanuts but it will be cheaper than the flat rate of two kids of the same age at the same time.
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#8051283 - 01/19/15 10:36 AM
Re: Embarking on quite the journey, ver. life
[Re: iamfob]
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spd-dmn
Post Master
Registered: 11/24/04
Posts: 2271
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i think it was hamilton chrysler that had the grand caravan CVP for like 199/mo on a 2-year lease
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#8051284 - 01/19/15 10:37 AM
Re: Embarking on quite the journey, ver. life
[Re: iamfob]
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furball
Post Master Sr
Registered: 09/24/03
Posts: 9551
Loc: Toronto, ON
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If you want to try to preserve the minivan's interior, cover it up taxi cab style with vinyl... floors too. Either DIY or google some covers...
I did my own ghetto set back in the day for the headrests in the back; I was carpooling for 6 mths and some of the fuckers had greasy hair 
Edited by furball (01/19/15 10:37 AM)
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#8051318 - 01/19/15 10:55 AM
Re: Embarking on quite the journey, ver. life
[Re: SuPeR-MaRiO]
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Risky Business
Provides a Great Work Environment.
Post Master Supreme
Registered: 05/17/10
Posts: 45849
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Congrats, your world is about to get rocked upside down.
In reality, I am sure you will be fine! Easy for me to say from the sidelines of course, but being close to two families on my wife's side with 4 kids each it's not the end of the world. If anything it seems to me their kids are smarter/more independent/better disciplined than those with two or less. 
Costco will be your best friend, and planning more efficiently such as your trips/activities/day to day routines will go a long way for you.
Don't be shy to rely on your parents either and extended family/close friends. If they are offering, then tell them to put their money where their mouth is (they will). Knowing how *our* families are, you pull together just fine. We are always taking our nieces out for dates, giving the parents time to themselves, they come here for sleepovers, etc. Hell I just spent the weekend redoing a nursery and doing a ton of shit to wife's cousin's house since they are busy with a newborn and other kid. I don't mind, that's what family is for. The other added benefit is that your kids are getting to the age where they can help out and they will or else (belt/slipper/hammerfist/uppsercut/pick your weapon )
Having said that and seeing your house, you're most likely better off to stay put and repurposing your space to fit your needs (think it through). Moving will only add more to an already busy life and in the end you will be net negative on the money and with a longer mortgage amort and amount. Once they are born and older, you are both working you can revisit the topic since space most likely won't be an issue until kids are older and need seperate bedrooms. Financial piece of mind now will go a long way to helping you focus on actually raising your kids/surviving this circus.
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#8051454 - 01/19/15 12:23 PM
Re: Embarking on quite the journey, ver. life
[Re: TheRealCSnapper]
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Euphoricuck
Post Master Supreme
Registered: 11/05/03
Posts: 92703
Loc: Canadistan
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pardon my ignorance, but are rapist style cargo vans safe to commute your kids around in?
If so, is that an option worth exploring? Get a cargo van and keep a sedan (or one of your existing car) for weekend driving/date nights?
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#8051478 - 01/19/15 12:32 PM
Re: Embarking on quite the journey, ver. life
[Re: Euphoricuck]
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Screamin' Type-R
Post Master Supreme
Registered: 02/20/01
Posts: 47961
Loc: T.O. - Canaduh
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#8051526 - 01/19/15 12:59 PM
Re: Embarking on quite the journey, ver. life
[Re: SuPeR-MaRiO]
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Big Tasty
Post Master Supreme
Registered: 02/10/02
Posts: 20020
Loc: Toronto
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They all talk as well so they all want the same things. If you interview a few it will be the same things coming from each person. They will more than likely want you to foot a monthly TTC pass as well. Tell them you will give them tokens and see the reaction
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#8051672 - 01/19/15 02:54 PM
Re: Embarking on quite the journey, ver. life
[Re: 87ZCSi]
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Denis Si
Post Master
Registered: 04/11/01
Posts: 2798
Loc: T.O.
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Damn!!!! After my 2nd one I'm definitely doing a visectomy
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#8051680 - 01/19/15 03:01 PM
Re: Embarking on quite the journey, ver. life
[Re: Denis Si]
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Screamin' Type-R
Post Master Supreme
Registered: 02/20/01
Posts: 47961
Loc: T.O. - Canaduh
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Damn!!!! After my 2nd one I'm definitely doing a visectomy
vas does them, cheap too.
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