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#105934 - 07/25/05 07:17 PM B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Numbers In!!
b6ixteen Offline
Post Master Jr


Registered: 12/29/04
Posts: 1846
Loc: Florida
Quote:

I am in right lane for each. Overall I am happy with the times and I know I am capable of much better (see 60'), so I will just do some more practising with this new setup.

vs Mustang GT. . . ____________________ vs Integra LS (think stock). . . ___________vs Fully gutted EG w/stock B16


My setup: If its not mentioned, its stock.
Block: B20B
ACL race bearings
Eagle H-beam rods w/ARP rod bolts
Wiseco 10.8:1 pistons
KMS block guard

Head: Stock B16A2/PR3

Tranny: Stock S4
Toda lightened flywheel (~10lbs)
Some stage 1 clutch.

Misc.: AutoZone 3" SRI w/ K&N filter
DC Sports 4-1 (not 2.5" collector)
2.5" exhaust piping back
ARP headstuds
Golden Eagle VTEC conversion kit
EnDyn crankase breather kit
RC 370cc injectors
B&M FPR and fuel pressure gauge (set at 50psi)
Autometer oil pressure gauge
GSR water pump, oil pump, timing belt
OBD2b to OBD1 conversion harness
Chipped P28 w/Crome EMS (AFR WOT street tuned)






I am in the process of doing this build and ever so often, little questions arise and I just need to know if I am on the right track with it. I thought of doing this build ever since I got my B16 a year ago. I started acquiring parts couple weeks ago but it wasn't until last week when my motor blew (one week after hydrolocking) that I see the need to hurry the build. I need the car to be a everday driver, occasional drag car. . .maybe once every two months. I am concentrating on the bottom end for now, will do the head later on.

Parts I already have:
B20B block. . .stripped bare leaving only crank.
B16A2 motor. . .block has hole, head is stock and ok.
New GSR oil pump.
KMS block guard.
GSR water pump, timing belt and seals.
Eagle H beam rods (ordered and on its way).
Chipped P28 and Hondata S200. . .no conversion harness yet.

Parts to be ordered:
ARP headstuds
Golden Eagle LS/VTEC conversion kit
Wiseco pistons. . .not certain of CR yet.
ACL racing bearings.

What am I missing as far as getting the motor together is concerned?
What compression pistons should I get if I want to attain 11:1 with the B16 head?
Does all B-series motors use the same bearings. . .main, rods, thrust washers?

All and any help will be appreciated, thanks.

Edit: Placed times and current setup to 1st page. Original is on page 3.


Edited by b6ixteen (10/16/05 02:21 AM)

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#105935 - 07/25/05 09:19 PM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
surubasi00 Offline
Post Master Sr


Registered: 01/07/03
Posts: 3792
Loc: VA
call honda and compare part number with the engines i cant remember but im sure the bearings are the same....call and check...then call someone who carries ACL and get their bearings, they are cheaper. Call arias or weisco directly or go o their website, they have all those specs for b20 motors. You need a head gasket...check out the Poor mans type R post at the top...that should help you out a lot...good luck, its not that hard to do

Dave
_________________________
Turns out my dog is allergic to peanuts. - FortCollins

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#105936 - 07/25/05 10:46 PM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
b6ixteen Offline
Post Master Jr


Registered: 12/29/04
Posts: 1846
Loc: Florida
Thanks, the GE LS/VTEC kit comes with a headgasket thats why I didn't mention it. The reason I asked about the bearings, is that someone from a popular tuner shop in S. FL told me to make sure I use B16 bearings. I will find out from Honda tomorrow.
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#105937 - 07/27/05 02:10 PM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
b6ixteen Offline
Post Master Jr


Registered: 12/29/04
Posts: 1846
Loc: Florida
Am I the only one with this build?
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#105938 - 07/27/05 03:16 PM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
Happy Birthday Dr. BrokenLimits Moderator Offline
Post Master Supreme


Registered: 03/12/02
Posts: 30983
Loc: Nebraska
you are using stock rods? Thats going to be your incredibly weak link right there.

Nm saw you have Eagle Rods.

Everything appears to be in order. Make sure you have a header that clears a 1.8 block. The B16 header typically will not.

What ECU are you going to run?


Edited by BrokenLimits (07/27/05 03:17 PM)
_________________________
Brandon
BrokenLimits@gmail.com

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#105939 - 07/27/05 03:30 PM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
surubasi00 Offline
Post Master Sr


Registered: 01/07/03
Posts: 3792
Loc: VA
you aren't the only one...but it's typical to come here, get the information, and then they never come back and post how stuff went...oh well

Dave
_________________________
Turns out my dog is allergic to peanuts. - FortCollins

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#105940 - 07/27/05 08:04 PM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
b6ixteen Offline
Post Master Jr


Registered: 12/29/04
Posts: 1846
Loc: Florida
Ok, I just took off the B16 header today. I am going to run a P28 ECU. I will be sure to keep everything here just so that people can correct me an stuff. I am just trying to get feedback, and when the dyno numbers are in, will put em up as well.
Thanks.

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#105941 - 08/01/05 07:37 PM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
b6ixteen Offline
Post Master Jr


Registered: 12/29/04
Posts: 1846
Loc: Florida
Update. . .these babies came in today, coated like the Rs. Ordered the rods before but they are taking kinda long, suppose to start this weekend on the build.

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#105942 - 08/01/05 10:42 PM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
surubasi00 Offline
Post Master Sr


Registered: 01/07/03
Posts: 3792
Loc: VA
oh so fucking pretty,,,,im jealous

Dave
_________________________
Turns out my dog is allergic to peanuts. - FortCollins

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#105943 - 08/01/05 11:35 PM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
strsi Offline
Post Master Jr


Registered: 10/26/04
Posts: 1789
Loc: CA
what CR did u decide to go with on the pistons?
_________________________
2000 EBP Si 181.5whp, 119wtq- All Motor B16

1994 EG Hatch

2000 BMW 328ci

207 Forever- RIP

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#105944 - 08/02/05 12:24 AM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
b6ixteen Offline
Post Master Jr


Registered: 12/29/04
Posts: 1846
Loc: Florida
10.8:1, I think the VTEC head adds like 0.2 then I would be up near 11.1. Then later on with flat valves and thinner gasket, I might get up to 11.5:1. I am trying to keep it really street, even though in FL we have 93 octane.
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#105945 - 08/02/05 01:30 AM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
strsi Offline
Post Master Jr


Registered: 10/26/04
Posts: 1789
Loc: CA
yea, u'd be plenty fine w/ 11.5:1 on 93.
_________________________
2000 EBP Si 181.5whp, 119wtq- All Motor B16

1994 EG Hatch

2000 BMW 328ci

207 Forever- RIP

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#105946 - 08/02/05 10:21 AM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
b6ixteen Offline
Post Master Jr


Registered: 12/29/04
Posts: 1846
Loc: Florida
Yeah I figured so but I was more concerned with the longevity of the stock B20 sleeves on such high compression. Thats why I didn't really try to get it up greater than a 11.5:1.
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#105947 - 08/02/05 12:04 PM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
strsi Offline
Post Master Jr


Registered: 10/26/04
Posts: 1789
Loc: CA
ahh, yes the sleeves will be a weak point. I saw that ur getting eagle rods at least but It mentions nothing or rod bolts, make sure to get arp rod bolts.
_________________________
2000 EBP Si 181.5whp, 119wtq- All Motor B16

1994 EG Hatch

2000 BMW 328ci

207 Forever- RIP

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#105948 - 08/02/05 01:12 PM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
b6ixteen Offline
Post Master Jr


Registered: 12/29/04
Posts: 1846
Loc: Florida
Yeah I think the eagle rods come with ARP rod bolts.
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#105949 - 08/02/05 06:04 PM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
CivicVTi Offline
Sr Member


Registered: 12/02/99
Posts: 1176
Loc: Athens , Greece
B16 and b18 have different rod bearings. I am not sure on the main ones. I do not know about b20. What cams do you plan to use? What is the max rpm you plan to rev your engine?
_________________________
Honda Civic VTi '95 EG6 hatch (stock B16A2) B18C6 specR swap (Euro)

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#105950 - 08/02/05 06:44 PM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
b6ixteen Offline
Post Master Jr


Registered: 12/29/04
Posts: 1846
Loc: Florida
Thanks for the answer on the rod bearings; yes I did find out they were different and ordered race bearings for the B20. The entire head is stock for now, plan to do BC3+ or Blox B when head is done. Max rpm is possibly 8k, thats only for track days maybe, won't push it like the B16 cause I know it can't hold revs as good. More likely 7k if I have to rev that high daily.
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#105951 - 08/02/05 10:20 PM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
surubasi00 Offline
Post Master Sr


Registered: 01/07/03
Posts: 3792
Loc: VA
yeah you can do those cams with aftermarket pistons NO problem...the valve reliefs are bigger


with the bc3's you are going to need to rev highet than 8k...just fyi

Dave
_________________________
Turns out my dog is allergic to peanuts. - FortCollins

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#105952 - 08/03/05 12:59 AM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
b6ixteen Offline
Post Master Jr


Registered: 12/29/04
Posts: 1846
Loc: Florida
I thought they stopped making power at like 8500rpm; thats why I want to stick to mild stage 1 cams, cause I don't want to be revving like 9k+ to be making use of a cam's full potential. Good heads up though, thanks.
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#105953 - 08/03/05 04:47 AM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
CivicVTi Offline
Sr Member


Registered: 12/02/99
Posts: 1176
Loc: Athens , Greece
Your engine is capable of 8000rpm no problem. If you want to rev it higher you could install a block girdle for added strength. Just like the b18 engines. If I were you, I would also stick with stage1 cams. Also do not make the mistake most people do and use an ITR/skunk2 intake manifold. Keep the stock B16 intake manifold as it performs better up to 8000rpm. A 62-64mm throttle body wouldn't hurt though.
_________________________
Honda Civic VTi '95 EG6 hatch (stock B16A2) B18C6 specR swap (Euro)

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#105954 - 08/03/05 09:02 AM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
b6ixteen Offline
Post Master Jr


Registered: 12/29/04
Posts: 1846
Loc: Florida
Quote:

Your engine is capable of 8000rpm no problem. If you want to rev it higher you could install a block girdle for added strength. Just like the b18 engines. If I were you, I would also stick with stage1 cams. Also do not make the mistake most people do and use an ITR/skunk2 intake manifold. Keep the stock B16 intake manifold as it performs better up to 8000rpm. A 62-64mm throttle body wouldn't hurt though.


I'll keep the IM and TB info in mind.

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#105955 - 08/03/05 12:28 PM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
strsi Offline
Post Master Jr


Registered: 10/26/04
Posts: 1789
Loc: CA
BC3's will be great for ur motor. It will make tons of torque & not peak at that high of rpms. Check out jwyoung's build. Its a b16 peaking at 7800rpms on bc3's. Ur motor is bigger & higher CR then his so it should peak even lower. & I would also keep the stock intake mani cuz like vti said, it tends to be best under 8000rpms.
_________________________
2000 EBP Si 181.5whp, 119wtq- All Motor B16

1994 EG Hatch

2000 BMW 328ci

207 Forever- RIP

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#105956 - 08/03/05 03:11 PM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
b6ixteen Offline
Post Master Jr


Registered: 12/29/04
Posts: 1846
Loc: Florida
I saw the dyno he has and its really impressive, but I am not certain of his mod list. Right now I am relying on the power from the ~2.0 displacement, I will get the motor tune without the head work. Cams and stuff is for later on, so basically it will be a partially built bottom end with stock head.
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#105957 - 08/08/05 10:37 PM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
b6ixteen Offline
Post Master Jr


Registered: 12/29/04
Posts: 1846
Loc: Florida
Does anyone know to what motor specs the bolts for this build should be torqued? In other words, should I use the 96-00 Honda Civic Helms manual or the Acura Integra 94-01? I think GSR/ITR specs but not certain, need to be.
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#105958 - 08/09/05 12:48 AM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
jwyoung Offline
Jr Member


Registered: 01/12/05
Posts: 573
Loc: Ca, USA
whoa this thread is new to me... dude, i'm jealous.. i need to work on my block.. good luck

Edited by jwyoung (08/10/05 03:45 AM)
_________________________
00' E95P Si 178whp, 122tq on 89 octane - B16 all motor

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#105959 - 08/09/05 07:50 AM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
b6ixteen Offline
Post Master Jr


Registered: 12/29/04
Posts: 1846
Loc: Florida
You alread have an impressive motor . I am just trying to get one myself. So anyone know about what motor specs bolts should be torqued?
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#105960 - 08/09/05 09:31 AM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
strsi Offline
Post Master Jr


Registered: 10/26/04
Posts: 1789
Loc: CA
I'd imagine they're all the same or very similar, but
_________________________
2000 EBP Si 181.5whp, 119wtq- All Motor B16

1994 EG Hatch

2000 BMW 328ci

207 Forever- RIP

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#105961 - 08/11/05 03:40 PM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
DPK/Honda Offline
Newbie


Registered: 07/15/05
Posts: 44
Loc: W.C. All over the world.
I have heard that b20/b16 setups require a crankshaft ventilator (endyne, etc) I am not sure if this is only required for forced induction but I'd look into it, i think they're fairly cheap too. I know I have heard a few people on Club si say that a crankshaft ventilator is a must for a b20/b16. Anyone?
_________________________
"You have to face death and survive to feel more alive." -Canibus R.I.P: 2000 NBP SI: Turbonetics T3/T04E 309whp, 213lb/ft@15psi

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#105962 - 08/11/05 06:29 PM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
b6ixteen Offline
Post Master Jr


Registered: 12/29/04
Posts: 1846
Loc: Florida
I never heard this but I am thankful you mentioned it, I will seek out getting one. Anything that will prolong this motor's life is welcomed. I just read about the kit on "The Old One" and it does seem like something worth investing in. Its listed for $164, I was going to get a lightened flywheel but this seems to be more of an investment, where longevity is concerned.
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#105963 - 08/12/05 07:19 PM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
Ohjolt2 Offline
Jr Poster


Registered: 08/12/05
Posts: 119
It will run with out a catch can just fine. But it would be a good idea to set out up. My motor has been running over a year with out one. i dont have the vent line on the valve cover hooked up either.
_________________________
Jake 88 CRX SI CRVTEC 13.8 1/4

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#105964 - 08/12/05 10:15 PM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
b6ixteen Offline
Post Master Jr


Registered: 12/29/04
Posts: 1846
Loc: Florida
I wasn't planning on doing a breather for the valve cover still. Don't think its as important as the one for the block. I see your sig says 13.8 in the 1/4 Ohjolt2, whats your mods and how much does your car weighs?

Edit: Forgot to mention I went to the machine shop today to have the pistons/rods assembled only to find that one of the locks was missing, so one piston pin is loose in one of the piston/rod assembly. Could I just go to the Honda dealer and ask for a B20 piston lock and use it? I just want to know if the OEM lock will be just as good as the aftermarket one. Thanks.


Edited by b6ixteen (08/12/05 11:06 PM)

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#105965 - 08/13/05 10:31 AM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
Ohjolt2 Offline
Jr Poster


Registered: 08/12/05
Posts: 119
Piston lock? Piston pin? You mean the wrist pin? Dont OEM pistons and rods use a press fit system that isnt compatable with any aftermarket stuff? Anyway my car is gutted so i guess its pretty light. stock bottom end and stock b16 head. no internal mods yet. time was ran in falken st615's.
_________________________
Jake 88 CRX SI CRVTEC 13.8 1/4

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#105966 - 08/13/05 11:11 AM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
b6ixteen Offline
Post Master Jr


Registered: 12/29/04
Posts: 1846
Loc: Florida
I am referring to the piston lock also called a C-clip. Yes I recently heard aftermarket ones are different, but thanks for the headsup, I was so ready to call the Honda dealer to get this thing asap. But I found a local dealer who stock aftermarket pistons n stuff so I will contact them next week (close on weekends).

Thats a good time considering you have no internals. Is this B20B or Z?

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#105967 - 08/14/05 06:55 PM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
Ohjolt2 Offline
Jr Poster


Registered: 08/12/05
Posts: 119
Never bothered to look, engine was in the car when i bought it. Car was kinda fucked up in a lot of areas when i got it. So i had alot of work to do on the inside and unfucking wireing nightmares and stuff. Then i left for iraq, i never bothered to get to far into the engine. Its gutted though so its a few 100 lbs lighter than stock.
_________________________
Jake 88 CRX SI CRVTEC 13.8 1/4

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#105968 - 08/15/05 11:41 PM Re: B20B/B16A2 Frankenstein Build. . .Questions and Issues!!
b6ixteen Offline
Post Master Jr


Registered: 12/29/04
Posts: 1846
Loc: Florida
Got the clip and all pistons/rods assembly are ready to go. I need to know is resurfacing the B16 head is a must??

I am pulling the motor tomorrow, I am still waiting on the GE conversion kit (suppose to come Wednesday), a flywheel and the Endyn crankcase breather kit. Block is ready to assemble. Hoping to have the car running by weekend.

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