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2010 Mazda 3i Sport - THANKS OBAMA!!! 2008 Honda Fit - Has more JDM armrest than your car does. 2001 Suzuki SV650 "on the street where there is no lap timer, feel is all that really counts." - Scootergeek "IN THE GLORIOUS PEOPLE'S REVOLUTION, THE FIRST TO DIE WILL BE THE BOURGEOIS TOW TRUCK DRIVERS!!" - Syhopeful
LS1's have tickled 12's stock before too (very rare), but in general, they were not 109 mph cars and typically ran a mid 13. Although the new Camaro is porky, it's not much heavier than the old one and seems light years ahead in terms of refinement.
Chuck ran 12's in his T/A with just better rubber (not DR's), MMandFF ran 12's with two different cars (they powershift).
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2008 Infiniti G35x Sport 2008 Acura RDX
Wow seems like it gets out of the hole well with time and mph. Nice numbers forsure, they are quick then in my book( anything low 13s and below is ) looks like when I get my car back on the road I'm gonna have to try pretty hard to beat It haha
Registered: 01/03/00
Posts: 6056
Loc: Queens Village, NY
The old Camaro SS were mid 13sec cars trapping 105-106mph car on average. Only on the internet did they become 12 sec cars trapping close to 110mph. The new Camaro seems to be much closer to what the Internet previous gen Camaros could do. I saw a couple in person and I have to admit they look really nice. I wouldn't mind one at all. Maybe I'll test drive one.
Registered: 05/07/01
Posts: 11364
Loc: Lisle, IL formerly Kalamazoo, ...
Originally Posted By: cliff st-clair
The old Camaro SS were mid 13sec cars trapping 105-106mph car on average. Only on the internet did they become 12 sec cars trapping close to 110mph. The new Camaro seems to be much closer to what the Internet previous gen Camaros could do. I saw a couple in person and I have to admit they look really nice. I wouldn't mind one at all. Maybe I'll test drive one.
Agreed. I don't think I ever once saw a stock LS1 trapping more than about 105-106 and the overwhelming majority trapped 103-104.
I took a pic under the hood of a new camaro at a car show on saturday. still lots of room to fit a turbo under there lol.
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95 maxima 11.7 @ 123mph - stock 3.0L tuned by me on 93octane 12.9 @ 104mph - stock 3.5L w/ bolt ons
Weren't the (rare) LS1 12 second runs always at like 106-108mph? I don't remember ever seeing a 109, but it was a long time ago.
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2010 Mazda 3i Sport - THANKS OBAMA!!! 2008 Honda Fit - Has more JDM armrest than your car does. 2001 Suzuki SV650 "on the street where there is no lap timer, feel is all that really counts." - Scootergeek "IN THE GLORIOUS PEOPLE'S REVOLUTION, THE FIRST TO DIE WILL BE THE BOURGEOIS TOW TRUCK DRIVERS!!" - Syhopeful
Not only is it faster,but it's quieter,handles better,has better brakes,is more roomier,a better warranty,will probably respond to mods better and it has a better interior,that only 3/4s of the dash fappers will berate.
I saw one two weeks ago and thought the interior was nice for a pony car. I thought the quality of plastics wasnt impressive,but the panel fit was nice and it looked like all the switchgear was good. Too many people get caught up comparing it to GTIs and BMWs,before they realise that those cars dont run 12s.
These cars,you get to pay for the drivetrain instead of the germanic interior.
Not only is it faster,but it's quieter,handles better,has better brakes,is more roomier,a better warranty,will probably respond to mods better and it has a better interior,that only 3/4s of the dash fappers will berate.
I saw one two weeks ago and thought the interior was nice for a pony car. I thought the quality of plastics wasnt impressive,but the panel fit was nice and it looked like all the switchgear was good. Too many people get caught up comparing it to GTIs and BMWs,before they realise that those cars dont run 12s.
These cars,you get to pay for the drivetrain instead of the germanic interior.
Well, and it doesn't look like a titanic-sized catfish. Don't get me wrong, the older Camaros looked mean but the newer ones just look better IMHO.
Registered: 04/29/00
Posts: 58003
Loc: Spicewood, Texas, USA
Originally Posted By: progressi
Not only is it faster,but it's quieter,handles better,has better brakes,is more roomier,a better warranty,will probably respond to mods better and it has a better interior,that only 3/4s of the dash fappers will berate.
I saw one two weeks ago and thought the interior was nice for a pony car. I thought the quality of plastics wasnt impressive,but the panel fit was nice and it looked like all the switchgear was good. Too many people get caught up comparing it to GTIs and BMWs,before they realise that those cars dont run 12s.
These cars,you get to pay for the drivetrain instead of the germanic interior.
135i gives you all of that, in a smaller/lighter package.
_________________________ So we trade liquor for blood in an attempt to tip the scales. I think you lost what you loved in that mess of details... they seemed so important at the time.
Those two cars cater to a completely different demographic. Pony cars are almost in a class of their own. If BMW made a stripped down 5 series coupe with a v8 we could compare,but the 1 series compact with a turbo 6 and boring styling is not going to be competition.
In short,someone who wants a v8 musclecar isnt going to look at BMWs smallest performance coupe. They want style,and a v8. I bet they're more likely to want to mod that car too,which BMW seems highly against.
There are about 10x the amount of people here on SVA that would cross-shop the two,compared to the "real world". I doubt I would,they are almost polar opposites.
Registered: 04/29/00
Posts: 58003
Loc: Spicewood, Texas, USA
Yeah, you can always say it's different to suit the mood.
But, the fact remains... they offer similar performance from new, are similarly priced, and one is far nicer... plus cheaper to insure/free to maintain.
_________________________ So we trade liquor for blood in an attempt to tip the scales. I think you lost what you loved in that mess of details... they seemed so important at the time.
Registered: 12/10/00
Posts: 17297
Loc: San Diego, CA
135's arent trapping 109, and the camaro is going to be several thousand cheaper in base trim.
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<Napalm> if i was going to be white, i want to be like dank <Seelen> you guys are fags for caring about the environment <max> one day before I die I'm going to own a swapped honda <@jsmonet> somewhere deep inside i'm hiding a lust for a 1.8L ek hatch <Dahlia> my puss is always warm
Only free to mainmtain for the first 50k miles though, right? That's 2 years of driving for me... after that I have a feeling that maintenance will be twice as much (and potentially twice as frequent).
I'd prefer a 1 series over a Camaro, but even with 2 years of free maintenance I think I'd spend more in maintenance over a 5-7 year period.
In short,someone who wants a v8 musclecar isnt going to look at BMWs smallest performance coupe. They want style,and a v8. I bet they're more likely to want to mod that car too,which BMW seems highly against.
I look at everything when consider a new car. The 135 might be BMW's smallest car, but it probably has as much interior/storage space as the Camaro and similar overall performance with more options too. I am checking out G35 sedans, Maximas, 330's, Genesis coupes, Camaros, Mustangs etc. I know not everyone is me, but a guy at my work was checking out used Caymans, S2000s, Mustangs, Camaros - used to own an RX8. It just comes down to a well thought out, moderately practical, decent performing package.
So they do get cross shopped by some people at least. The price/performance/features are all there to compete with the Camaro.
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2008 Infiniti G35x Sport 2008 Acura RDX
and one is far nicer... plus cheaper to insure/free to maintain.
You overestimate the quality of the interior/drivetrain of the 135i. Having driven an auto convertible one for over a week while waiting for another one to come in I wasn't impressed with what was a $48,000 car (auto and vert added $5k to price). For that money, you could get a SS and have plenty of change leftover. Even without the vert, an average price of $43,000 for a 135i isn't anywhere near a bargain.
For over $10k less, I'm much happier with my purchase of a 370. The interior of the 370 is far better than the boring ass interior of the 135i IMO.
In summary, the 135i does not set any standard for value (it's overpriced) or quality (it's average at best).
Oh, and that free maintenance means you have to wait until 8,000 miles for an oil change. And tires aren't included.
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2009 White 370Z 6M/Sport
and one is far nicer... plus cheaper to insure/free to maintain.
You overestimate the quality of the interior/drivetrain of the 135i. Having driven an auto convertible one for over a week while waiting for another one to come in I wasn't impressed with what was a $48,000 car (auto and vert added $5k to price). For that money, you could get a SS and have plenty of change leftover. Even without the vert, an average price of $43,000 for a 135i isn't anywhere near a bargain.
For over $10k less, I'm much happier with my purchase of a 370. The interior of the 370 is far better than the boring ass interior of the 135i IMO.
In summary, the 135i does not set any standard for value (it's overpriced) or quality (it's average at best).
Oh, and that free maintenance means you have to wait until 8,000 miles for an oil change. And tires aren't included.
Yeah, it was supposed to be the second coming of the 2002.... cheap, lightweight, and quick. Unfortunately it's only one of those.
Yeah,I dont know why the 135 even came up. It was about how the new Camaro was fast,running a 12 bone stock. Then a comment comparing old vs new came up,fair enough. And yeah-a BMW is better?
Anyways,word is that a new,lightweight NA version of the 1 series is coming out in the spirit of the E30 M3. Sweet. There you go Pat.
Registered: 04/29/00
Posts: 58003
Loc: Spicewood, Texas, USA
Originally Posted By: progressi
Yeah,I dont know why the 135 even came up. It was about how the new Camaro was fast,running a 12 bone stock. Then a comment comparing old vs new came up,fair enough. And yeah-a BMW is better?
Oh, I can help... It is called a "discussion" and different personalities add to it how they see fit. Kind of a concept.
Anyway, the interior and build quality of the 1 series are worlds beyond that of the Camaro, why is exactly why it was mentioned. Yes, they are and will continue to be cross shopped by consumers and no way would I settle for a Nissan that is more expensive overall when I could have a BMW, what a joke!
_________________________ So we trade liquor for blood in an attempt to tip the scales. I think you lost what you loved in that mess of details... they seemed so important at the time.
no way would I settle for a Nissan that is more expensive overall when I could have a BMW, what a joke!
I'm sorry? Did you just say my car costs more than a 135i? Oh, and I raced a 335i coupe 6M yesterday. Apparently the cars are identically fast. We were side by side all the way to 95mph. We talked afterwards and apparently we were both shifting early because both our cars were brand new.
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2009 White 370Z 6M/Sport
Registered: 04/29/00
Posts: 58003
Loc: Spicewood, Texas, USA
$40,030 vs $43,475 initial purchase price.
Far cheaper insurance for the BMW, to the tune of just under $500/year... we'll call it $450. Free scheduled maintenance on the BMW vs how much on the Nissan? Resale/depreciation on the 135i is fantastic, on the Z not quite. Over a 4 year ownership period, this will easily go in favor of the 135i. I look at overall ownership costs, as well as my own personal value equation when comparing vehicles so MSRP to MSRP isn't a valid argument for... anything, except maybe monthly payment affordability.
So, don't be sorry... we all choose what we want.
_________________________ So we trade liquor for blood in an attempt to tip the scales. I think you lost what you loved in that mess of details... they seemed so important at the time.
It wasnt a discussion about BMWs though. It was about how fast the new Camaro is. Seems a bit fanboy to run in and go "A BMWS BETTER AND CHEAEPR."
And you're obsessed with using the maintenance to show the BMW as cheaper,but what happens when you start paying for those BMW parts yourself? Then Im sure whatever you've gained starts to look trivial in comparison. Ive heard the 1 series are going through alot of DI fuel pumps which are incredibly pricey. Noise was telling me part of the reason he bought another Evo X was that the failure rates are so high.
Registered: 04/29/00
Posts: 58003
Loc: Spicewood, Texas, USA
Originally Posted By: progressi
It wasnt a discussion about BMWs though. It was about how fast the new Camaro is. Seems a bit fanboy to run in and go "A BMWS BETTER AND CHEAEPR."
I didn't bring it up...
Originally Posted By: YOU lol
comparing it to GTIs and BMWs
And anyway, it's a discussion. They go different directions. We're humans, not robots programmed to respond only to the keywords YOU think we should use, or keep the topic running down the track YOU somehow determined. Don't want to talk about BMWs? Don't bring them up. And anyway, shut the fuck up with your fanboy bait shit already. Play yourself out on something else.
Quote:
And you're obsessed with using the maintenance to show the BMW as cheaper,but what happens when you start paying for those BMW parts yourself? Then Im sure whatever you've gained starts to look trivial in comparison. Ive heard the 1 series are going through alot of DI fuel pumps which are incredibly pricey. Noise was telling me part of the reason he bought another Evo X was that the failure rates are so high.
Well, that was his decision. The resale values and lack of inventory at dealerships tells me they must have gotten it at least a bit right. That, and driving them. So, I'm not obsessed with using anything but the facts. The BMW has great resale, the maintenance is paid for, and it is cheaper to insure. It's all part of the value equation, unless you're blind to reason.
As far as when it runs out of warranty... it would be gone. I don't get the point of that question. Are we assuming that someone who buys the new Camaro, a vehicle so very often purchased for it's style... as are all coupes, is going to keep it forever? That's just idiotic. OMG the BMW will cost more to fix, I think, out of warranty than the Camaro which I know nothing of it's parts prices! Add in the laundry list of issues with the new Camaro and I think to anyone with half a brain the choice makes itself very obvious.
_________________________ So we trade liquor for blood in an attempt to tip the scales. I think you lost what you loved in that mess of details... they seemed so important at the time.
Good for you Pat,funny you mention bots,you're like the irritated argument causing bot that can never let anything go.
Good job at the name calling,very childish. Oh well,you didnt get your way so you took the low road and threw a tantrum. I dont know what your problem's been but it's getting worse. You have pretty much nothing to offer this site any more except to be irritable and overly defensive. Look for new enemies elsewhere Pat,Im done with you.
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