| stickaz_old |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 06/12/14 03:54 PM |
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advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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san jose rock-n-roll marathon, Oct 5, 2014
gives me not quite 4 months
where I'm at: 10 miles/week, max long run of a 10k. Had been fighting some knee issues but those seem to have faded as I reduced mileage.
Goal is just to finish and then maybe go sub 2h, so just a bit over 9 min miles I guess.
Current 5k PR this year is 24:xx [8:00 pace], and my 10k PR is 53:xx, or 8:35/mi or so.
My brief internet research on "how to run a 1/2 marathon" seems to suggest running ~4x a week and 20-24 miles/week or so for this type of goal, with one 'long run' a week, and a mix of speed/tempo work and other stuff I dont really understand.
Am I going to be dissapointed if I gradually increase my mileage to ~15 a week with say a 'speed' day, a 'long/slow' day, and then maybe a tempo workout [3x/wk] on race day? [eg have a bad time or go over 2h, etc], eventually I plan to have my 'long run' in the 10-12 mile range [1x a week]
background: noob jogger that basically started light jogging in Feb. I have 157 miles jogged so far YTD per strava. Yes, I realize that is very little. Last couple months I'm averaging 10 miles/week tho except for 2 weeks I basically took off w/knee probs.
My stretch goal is say 1:45 to 1:50 or so, eg. avging a hair over 8:00/miles.
Any suggestions? I also train for sprint swimming and tris so getting much more time jogging is going to be tough without some sacrifices. Last month I tried to 'double up' workouts [eg swim + bike] or [bike + run] on a given day [~2 hrs of aerobic work/day] but I was burning out so I've backed off and I'm much happier for it.
| Design |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 06/12/14 04:08 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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I used this one:
http://www.halhigdon.com/training/51312/Half-Marathon-Novice-2-Training-Program
As most people will tell you the key is to not skip the long runs. With your current knee condition I strongly suggest 1) mild strength training, and 2) running no more than every other day. Take Sundays and Wednesdays (or whatever your mid-week would be) and do strength with some elliptical to keep pressure off the joints.
Deadlifts and back squats are easy but very effective leg/back exercises. In my case, it reduced recovery after long runs, from 3 days down to 1. GL.
| stickaz_old |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 06/12/14 04:43 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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cool thks, I'm ok with 'simply finishing' and being at/around/just over 2h also. I pretty much hate running but there is some intersection between greater running fitness and doing better in my planned distance for tris [international with the 10k] so I figure why not.
I don't want anything crazy there just say sub 50:00 around this timeframe also on the run leg. hopefully these goals all sort of overlap.
also it should be plainly stated that I don't currently [not in the last couple years] run anywhere near this distance. I think I accidentally did 7.7 miles on a planned 10k workout recently. That was about it. So theres that lol.
| Sir Ironpool |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 06/12/14 05:45 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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The Higdon plans are great...but like Kent hinted, getting to the race in healthy shape is more important than anything. The plans are great because they don't let you do too much too quickly.
| Lividentity |
| (Major Member) |
| 06/13/14 07:26 AM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Definitely go with the Higdon plans. I've used them for 2 half marathons and 1 full and planning on doing it again this year for another full.
| **DONOTDELETE** |
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| 06/13/14 10:39 AM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Good luck OP. This is how it starts though.
| stickaz_old |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 06/30/14 11:26 AM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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in the #whocares #stoppostingOP file, I officially signed up for the san jose one[before the price went up yet again]
->http://runrocknroll.competitor.com/san-jose
in the 1:55 corral when they asked for an estimated time to be placed among similar 'runners'
that's an 8:50/mi pace or thereabouts
Sunday Oct 5 is my doomsday
*I secretly want to go out a bit quicker and see what happens lol curled up on the sidewalk at mile 10
**as an update to the thread a week ago I managed to do an 11 miler, so I'm getting close to replicating the distance. I think I can go a bit longer than those awesome plans referenced above. Still trying to learn what HR pace [approx.] or HR zone to use for aerobic training.
I tried to do a zone 2 'run' yesterday [~130 HR max] and perhaps it was because I was recovering/kind of spent from a race the day before I was running 11+ minute miles lol. Or maybe that should be my long-run speed for now.
| **DONOTDELETE** |
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| 06/30/14 11:41 AM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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I think you'll be able to push to a bit faster than that, but I doubt you'll break 1:50 yet. Though if you're only running? not having to cycle or swim? You might.
FWIW, that's faster than my best so far.
And yeah, I've long thought your LSR pace should be slower. Maybe not 11+ slow, like you said you were recovering. But most the calculators says 2.5 minutes slower than your 5k pace is a good proximation.
| Design |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 06/30/14 01:29 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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My suggestion is don't push yourself too hard the first time out and possibly set yourself up for disappointment. There are so many factors such as crowds, hydration, weather, etc. Just go out, take it all in, and enjoy the ride the first time out.
| Lividentity |
| (Major Member) |
| 06/30/14 01:55 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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You're got 3 months to train and already ran an 11 miler? You shouldn't have any issues with the distance than. In reality you don't even need to run 11 miles to train for a half. If you want to be faster go do some speed work and some hills if you can. You're going to do a lot better if once a week you only run 3 miles, but it is quarter mile repeats than if you do 1 more 8 mile run, imho. Those Hal Higdon plans sure worked that way for me. I followed the plan, actually did speed work and dropped 10 mins on my half PR.
| stickaz_old |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 06/30/14 02:04 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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so reading between the lines I should do something like this?
Tues: pace 5k [for me, something like 8:30 miles]--for a goal pace of 1/2@ 1:50
thurs: Hill repeats or 400m repeats [zone 4 aka hard!], 3 miles or so
Fri: tiny brick at the end of a bike [5k or so], around 9:00 pace [??]
su: long/slow run: 8-10 miles around 10:00/mi pace
sound reasonable for now?
puts me around 15-20 miles for the week depending if I skip thurs or fri [or do both]
on a side note I'll be masters swimming 2x a week and 1-2 surf days/week, at least 1 day of weights and 3-4 bike commute days + possibly a weekend ride so around 80 miles/week
this is probably the absolute max I can squeeze in running without sacrificing something else or doing 2x/day workouts -- which seem to hard for me
thanks for the advice everyone. I think perhaps simple survival is best in my first half. Maybe go out on 9:00 for a solid 5 miles or so and if I feel up to it, maybe push it a little.
| Cheesegoggles |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 06/30/14 02:08 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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When can we start calling out OP for not being a "noob jogger"/beginner any longer?
| stickaz_old |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 06/30/14 02:09 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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10k under 50:00 posted on strava?
I've always heard 8:00 pace is the arbitrary threshold between running and jogging?
| **DONOTDELETE** |
| () |
| 06/30/14 04:22 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Originally Posted By: Something Witty
10k under 50:00 posted on strava?
Yiiisss!
I'm still a yogger!
| stickaz_old |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 08/08/14 01:42 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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update:
body seems to be holding ~15 mile/week pace. wooo
been getting some more quality speedwork in lately, generally been getting the long run in weekly
I'm still a bit scared of the distance/race but it's good for me to have something over my head that is tough to do. Motivates me to get out and jog.
as an example this week I did a tues/thurs tempo-ish short-ish runs (~3m ea), today I'll throw a brick onto a bike commute, and sunday I will do a long run that allows my weekly total to hit 15-16 miles [so sorta depends how far I go on the brick]
Last week I found myself some hills and got some vert in for running. Was nice really, a nice change-up to the flat running I've always done.
| Sir Ironpool |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 08/08/14 01:52 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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I highly suggest getting that weekly mileage up to at least 20-25...you'll likely have a far better experience at the race (and recovery-wise).
| Impulsive |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 08/08/14 02:02 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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I'd agree. I'm pretty sure I could run a half without much issue, but I tend to run 21-25 per week on average in addition to biking a bit over 40.
I'm not the racer in this group, but if your max runs are in the 10k range, just map out a 15k run and do it one day.
| stickaz_old |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 08/08/14 02:03 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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how does this sound? I'm sorta fighting not-re-injuring my knee also
Eg week 1: 15 [this week]
week 2: 16.5
week 3: 18.1
week 4: 19.9 [call it 20!]
week 5: 15 [recover week! woo]
week 6: 20-22
week 7: 15 [taper!]
week 8: 6 [taper!] race week
my long runs presently are in the 8-12 mile range [1x/week], converted to canuck I guess that 11k to 20k
| **DONOTDELETE** |
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| 08/08/14 02:04 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Originally Posted By: Mrs. Ironmom
I highly suggest getting that weekly mileage up to at least 20-25...you'll likely have a far better experience at the race (and recovery-wise).
With only ~7 weeks and his other training, I'm not sure pushing to 25 would be advised. That's a big increase.
but 15 seems a little light for your first 1/2. I mean I've done 1/2s on 5 miles a week, but my goal pace was slow, and I'd done a few. I had no pain the next day fwiw.
| Impulsive |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 08/08/14 02:08 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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If you're already doing that long of runs, I think you'll be just fine.
I find my knees are bugging me a bit lately (patella rubbing I think). I think it's a combination of biking and squats (and not that much rest). I might try skipping squats for a week since they fuck my legs for 3 days anwyays.
| stickaz_old |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 08/08/14 02:28 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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the week before I have my 'A' race international distance tri for the year
[wee, great timing...]which means I probably won't quite get the mileage I listed above. Hopefully will hold 15-18 from here out tho. that week should be rough for me [sep 28/sunday my first international Tri, the following sunday oct 5/my first 1/2 marathon]
lol, which is why I list a 2-week taper. Oh well, hopefully next year I can worry about being fast(er)
| Sir Ironpool |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 08/08/14 02:52 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Originally Posted By: dirtyS13drifta
Originally Posted By: Mrs. Ironmom
I highly suggest getting that weekly mileage up to at least 20-25...you'll likely have a far better experience at the race (and recovery-wise).
With only ~7 weeks and his other training, I'm not sure pushing to 25 would be advised. That's a big increase.
but 15 seems a little light for your first 1/2. I mean I've done 1/2s on 5 miles a week, but my goal pace was slow, and I'd done a few. I had no pain the next day fwiw.
Nah, 6 weeks would be plenty of time to build up to an extra 5
-7 miles a week before he tapers for this race. Like I said, it would make his race far more enjoyable with far less walking.
Either way, he'll do fine.
| stickaz_old |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 08/08/14 03:20 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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walking? really? lol I'd be surprised if I get any split over 9:00
when the heat was less, I avg'd 8:45 over 11 miles recently. I did stop to pee tho for like ~2 mins [~3 months ago]
| **DONOTDELETE** |
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| 08/08/14 05:21 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Originally Posted By: Mrs. Ironmom
Originally Posted By: dirtyS13drifta
Originally Posted By: Mrs. Ironmom
I highly suggest getting that weekly mileage up to at least 20-25...you'll likely have a far better experience at the race (and recovery-wise).
With only ~7 weeks and his other training, I'm not sure pushing to 25 would be advised. That's a big increase.
but 15 seems a little light for your first 1/2. I mean I've done 1/2s on 5 miles a week, but my goal pace was slow, and I'd done a few. I had no pain the next day fwiw.
Nah, 6 weeks would be plenty of time to build up to an extra 5
-7 miles a week before he tapers for this race. Like I said, it would make his race far more enjoyable with far less walking.
Either way, he'll do fine.
7 weeks to increase 10 miles wouldn't be much, though it's still nearly double his current weekly mileage. We're not talking about an established runner though, he's already ramped up a lot. And he has many other activities, and has already had his body tell him to watch it(see knee posts 3 months ago).
I think based on the dramatic change in lifestyle in the last 12 months, he'd have to trade off by reducing one of his other activities.
I honestly don't think that 1 week of doing 25 miles vs say 20, for a half, offers much benefit. But I think it does increase risk. That's my opinion.
Op will probably be fine though either way.
| Sir Ironpool |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 08/08/14 05:26 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Lol, wasn't trying to offend you...just offering my suggestion in a "looking for advice" thread, based on my personal experience.
| stickaz_old |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 08/08/14 05:29 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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thanks for the advice, I am scared of some kind of lower-body issue tho, honestly.
probably the 10% rule is safe to follow [per that table I posted above] to ramp to maybe 22 miles 6 weeks from today though. woot
btw fuck running!
| Sir Ironpool |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 08/08/14 05:30 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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/backs out of thread.
| stickaz_old |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 08/08/14 05:33 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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nah it's fine, I appreciate all advice. Perhaps Art or somebody can come by soon and call me fat to help complete the circle
I will try to increase mileage, but I am an old fat fuck and am reaching a bit here. Super desk jockey too. However it is also fun pushing the boundaries a bit. I can safely say I no longer hate running quite as much as I used to. Who knows, might stick with it for a bit
my weight has crept up to 194# also lol! I'm not sure wtf is going on it *could* be lean mass but somehow I doubt it
**also of note, now only 6#'s away from racing as a cylde! [200# + in some races]
***project fat-fuck resumed. I knew that was too much beer
| Sir Ironpool |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 08/08/14 05:53 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Keep in mind that I was in a very similar position as you when I started my foray into this nuttiness. Mid 30's, 60 pounds overweight and couch to full retard in 10 seconds flat.
I know what it's like fear injury and to deal with all those initial aches and pains as your body gets used to this new stress put on it. The thing with running though, is that the only way to make it stronger and more resistant to injury is to push it. That 10% IMO is very conservative. As long as you listen to it, your body is capable of much more stress. You have a good base fitness already, so ramping up a little should be okay. You're getting very little ROI from swimming and biking, so it's okay to ease off those and put a little more I to your run, where you'll see the tangible results come race day (in both the Tri and half)
13.1 is great distance because it demands respect, but also because you can "race" it. My own results went:
1:50
1:45
1:29
all in about 18 months. No specific training other than building up my mileage base.
The main thing is to have fun though, so do what works for you. I've successfully "coached" a handful of people to PR's at multiple distances, so I know that my suggestions don't just work for me. Take whatever you want out of all that, and go out and kick some ass.
| gamby |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 08/08/14 05:56 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Gaining weight at this activity level is impressive. Are you doing the "I'm training a ton so I'll eat whatever the fuck I want and burn it off later" method?
Even dropping 5 lbs will reduce the shock on your legs a good amount. I hope you can figure it out (you know the answer, it's just an answer that is no fun at all).
| Ampsman in Extremis |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 08/08/14 06:10 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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I would get out on the trails once a week for hills, great speed work plus its easier on your body than pounding the pavement.
Hit me up and I can take you out and show you some good spots if you're up.
| Sir Ironpool |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 08/08/14 06:12 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Originally Posted By: ampsman
I would get out on the trails once a week for hills, great speed work plus its easier on your body than pounding the pavement.
Hit me up and I can take you out and show you some good spots if you're up.
Hit me up and I can take you out and show you some good spots if you're up.
| Ampsman in Extremis |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 08/08/14 06:19 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Originally Posted By: Mrs. Ironmom
Originally Posted By: ampsman
I would get out on the trails once a week for hills, great speed work plus its easier on your body than pounding the pavement.
Hit me up and I can take you out and show you some good spots if you're up.
Hit me up and I can take you out and show you some good spots if you're up.
| stickaz_old |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 08/08/14 06:35 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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| Design |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 08/08/14 11:17 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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I also disagree on increasing the mileage this soon before the half. Especially with the OP's previous injuries. The key is really the long run with at least two shorter runs to keep the leg muscles fresh. Maybe work in elliptical and/or strength training on the off days.
Finish the race, evaluate, decide if worth doing more competitively. My 2 cents...
| stickaz_old |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 09/14/14 11:37 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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3 weeks out and I made the distance for the first time in my life. Feeling really pwnt if I were to be honest about it. Jumped in the pacific after and it felt glorious for some reason. My watch says I did 13.2 in 2:20 or about 10:30 pace (my long slow pace per the plan I'm following) strava thinks I did it in 2:28 but I did stop for water a couple times and a few traffic lights and pee break
Looks like ill make it, still have a shot at sub 2hr I guess but I'm not so sure
| **DONOTDELETE** |
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| 09/15/14 10:12 AM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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I'd guess you'll crack 2. LSRs are way different than race. And even if you don't crack 2, you've made great progress building up to doing that sort of distance(especially for not being a runner)
Great job man, rooting for you.
| gamby |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 09/15/14 10:20 AM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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How did you feel this morning? Beaten up?
| Design |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 09/15/14 10:35 AM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Good job man!
| stickaz_old |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 09/15/14 11:54 AM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Originally Posted By: g@mby
How did you feel this morning? Beaten up?
let's see , left calf doesnt seem to extend all the way right now, I cant really bring my left heel to the ground without a bit of discomfort
my right foot, possibly as a consequence when I left UP hurts a bit
my left hip/leg extender whatever its called [up near my waist] hurts a bit when I extend my leg/attempt to walk lol. Wow thats new. I felt it a bit on miles 10+ or so yesterday.
basically I could whine some more but I think thats a good list
I did not bike to work today but not because I didnt think I could do it but because I have to bounce between a ton of buildings and meet with people today. Am subtly limping unless I've been sitting for a while, then definintely limping. So in other words I think I'm functional heh. Will masters swim tonight but I'll probably cramp on the very first lap of the first kick set.
| Euphoricuck |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 09/15/14 02:14 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Originally Posted By: stickaz
Looks like ill make it, still have a shot at sub 2hr I guess but I'm not so sure
| stickaz_old |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 09/15/14 02:47 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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I think I can but I'd be averaging my 10K PR from May/June [the first time I ran that distance in 15+ yrs] for a bit over 2x the distance
I'm going to try and GPS-watch-pace-force myself to make it with an ever so slight negative split.
Eg:
9:30 mile 1 [traffic/mob allowance]
9:15 mile 2-3 [call it a warmup]
9:08-9:10 mile 4-10] [at goal pace]
9:00 or less miles 10-13.1
will sneak me under 2H
avg needs to be 9:09/or less/mile. Which I realize is not fast. But I'm basically a couch to N distance runner. I ran ~30 miles in all of 2013, and I'm sitting at 350 on the year for 2014.
what do you guys think of that plan? also I dont glance at my watch much [maybe every quarter mile or so to check the pace], and I guess the course itself has a nice fat clock at the halfway point so I should be at/around 1h when I hit it. Otherwise I guess its just make it up as I go along--even at a steady pace [??] my GPS watch has me bouncing all over the place from like 8:30 to 9:30 and everywhere in between. I have to wait for the end of a mile to get my split [should have bought the 220 watch hah instead of the 210]
Plan B of course is to keep the 2H pacer group in sight and to pass them at mile 10 if I can. I'm kinda thinking this should be plan [A] as long as my watch agrees they arent going out to fast and seem to be on pace. [I heard they screw up sometimes, but probably not in this slow of a group]
| Sir Ironpool |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 09/15/14 04:19 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Personally. I don't like pace groups. Your putting your race in somebody else's hands and they're notorious for doing a horrible job.
If I were you, And I really wanted that sub 2:00, then I'd set my watch to show average pace (not current) and not even look at it till it beeps at each mile (or half mile if it's capable of that). Know what your fail safe pace is, and don't go below that. Don't try to bank time, don't try to negative split. Focus on running an even, smart, and consistent race. Your first mile or three will be faster than intended, and it will feel really easy, but don't fall for thinking that will last. Ease back to that pace you decided on, focus on your form, breathing and not getting tripped up by other runners.
Congrats on a successful long run! That will be a confidence booster come race day.
| stickaz_old |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 09/15/14 05:20 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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cool, my watch is kinda basic so I'll play around with it and see if it can do something like that. It definitely has 'avg' pace, so that can work I bet. Just a little worried that if I fall like 30 to 60s off of pace towards the end that I wont notice until its too late
| **DONOTDELETE** |
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| 09/15/14 05:53 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Chris's advice is spot on, even pace is considered more efficient than varying.
Hell, just time yourself, IIRC every effing mile is marked. I've never had GPS on a race. Your effort is your best guide.
| stickaz_old |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 09/15/14 06:09 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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is it really a 'varying pace' to spot myself +21s the first mile for traffic/mob start and then the next 2 a +6s to 'settle in' followed by a dead-on goal pace the next 7-8 and a slight [-9s] negative split for the final 5k-ish?
what I'm reading suggests that is the PERFECT way to PR an ET
| Ampsman in Extremis |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 09/15/14 06:20 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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what do you mean negative split the final 5k? Splits are halves.
| stickaz_old |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 09/15/14 06:25 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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each mile in the final k I am to run at a slightly-faster-than-avg-goal pace [9s/mile]. Forgive me for misusing the term. I suppose it works out the same though. Not seeing the 'extreme variance' of 20s longer in the first half vs 20s shorter in the 2nd half tho
[in a 2 hour race!]we're talking about 0.03 mph difference
as in ... the entire discussion is moot. I have no where near the ability to pace this accurately [9s here, 6s there, etc] lol
| Sir Ironpool |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 09/15/14 06:49 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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I think you're overthinking it man.
It's good to have a plan, but since this is your first half, I think you should just focus on running by feel and just using the watch/clock as a general guide. The crowd at the front isn't going to slow you down that much if you seed yourself appropriately. 13.1 is a great distance because it's short enough to run hard, but long enough that there is a risk of blowing up. It's all about settling into a pace you can maintain. If you feel like you have something left at 12, then throw in a surge in that last mile.
| **DONOTDELETE** |
| () |
| 09/15/14 06:52 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Originally Posted By: Mrs. Ironmom
I think you're overthinking it man.
It's good to have a plan, but since this is your first half, I think you should just focus on running by feel and just using the watch/clock as a general guide. The crowd at the front isn't going to slow you down that much if you seed yourself appropriately. 13.1 is a great distance because it's short enough to run hard, but long enough that there is a risk of blowing up. It's all about settling into a pace you can maintain. If you feel like you have something left at 12, then throw in a surge in that last mile.
It's good to have a plan, but since this is your first half, I think you should just focus on running by feel and just using the watch/clock as a general guide. The crowd at the front isn't going to slow you down that much if you seed yourself appropriately. 13.1 is a great distance because it's short enough to run hard, but long enough that there is a risk of blowing up. It's all about settling into a pace you can maintain. If you feel like you have something left at 12, then throw in a surge in that last mile.
ALLL OF THIS!
| stickaz_old |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 09/15/14 07:16 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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OK makes sense
| stickaz_old |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 09/16/14 12:06 AM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Swim practice tonight felt GLORIUS
Some of you runner types should consider it, IMO. Maybe its mental but I feel so recovered now. My feet feel normal again too and.I didn't even cramp
Plus the spa afterward didn't hurt any either
| Design |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 09/16/14 12:30 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Tri training has certainly improved my overall fitness no doubt. But swimming isn't for everyone...
| volty |
| (Post Master Jr) |
| 09/17/14 03:19 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Originally Posted By: Mrs. Ironmom
I think you're overthinking it man.
It's good to have a plan, but since this is your first half, I think you should just focus on running by feel and just using the watch/clock as a general guide. The crowd at the front isn't going to slow you down that much if you seed yourself appropriately. 13.1 is a great distance because it's short enough to run hard, but long enough that there is a risk of blowing up. It's all about settling into a pace you can maintain. If you feel like you have something left at 12, then throw in a surge in that last mile.
It's good to have a plan, but since this is your first half, I think you should just focus on running by feel and just using the watch/clock as a general guide. The crowd at the front isn't going to slow you down that much if you seed yourself appropriately. 13.1 is a great distance because it's short enough to run hard, but long enough that there is a risk of blowing up. It's all about settling into a pace you can maintain. If you feel like you have something left at 12, then throw in a surge in that last mile.
I'm going to agree with all of this. I wish I had seen the thread sooner. I ran my first half last year with like no training. I think my 5k PR at that point was 24ish mins. Averaging maybe 10 miles a week, if that, for about 3 months before the run.
Just run with the people around you. Seed yourself HIGHER than you think you can do. Everyone else does it at these fucking things. At NYC this past spring I put down 1:45 (finished in 1:41) and I was passing motherfuckers for the first mile left and right. At RockAndRoll DC I put 2:00 (my first half) and people were walking after less than a mile.
Seed yourself higher, find what feels like a challenging pace, and let the others around you push you. You will run faster times each mile than you think you could. Drop the watch, focus on your breathing. If you feel like blowing up, make a bargain to try and push it to the next mile. If you make that next mile, you're fine.
I love 13.1 miles. By the end I feel exhausted... but my body isnt trashed.
| stickaz_old |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 09/17/14 07:59 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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cool, I don't really have much hope that I'm any faster than the 1:55 I seeded myself at, I really doubt it or I would have seen it somewhere by now
I now know I can run the whole thing at least though lol. I figure based on my running [all 350 miles of it] so far this year that any miles spent sub 9:00 I will pay for dearly towards the end. Yea, I'm not fast /shocker
| Risky Business |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 09/17/14 08:26 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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You have solid discipline and training consistency (aside from bike - who am I to talk to doe?
), you will rock it!
| gamby |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 09/17/14 11:29 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Originally Posted By: stickaz
Originally Posted By: g@mby
How did you feel this morning? Beaten up?
let's see , left calf doesnt seem to extend all the way right now, I cant really bring my left heel to the ground without a bit of discomfort
my right foot, possibly as a consequence when I left UP hurts a bit
my left hip/leg extender whatever its called [up near my waist] hurts a bit when I extend my leg/attempt to walk lol. Wow thats new. I felt it a bit on miles 10+ or so yesterday.
basically I could whine some more but I think thats a good list
I did not bike to work today but not because I didnt think I could do it but because I have to bounce between a ton of buildings and meet with people today. Am subtly limping unless I've been sitting for a while, then definintely limping. So in other words I think I'm functional heh. Will masters swim tonight but I'll probably cramp on the very first lap of the first kick set.
Ouch.
I feel longer runs (10k is "long" for me) in my hip flexors bigtime.
| **DONOTDELETE** |
| () |
| 09/18/14 07:18 AM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Originally Posted By: volty
Originally Posted By: Mrs. Ironmom
I think you're overthinking it man.
It's good to have a plan, but since this is your first half, I think you should just focus on running by feel and just using the watch/clock as a general guide. The crowd at the front isn't going to slow you down that much if you seed yourself appropriately. 13.1 is a great distance because it's short enough to run hard, but long enough that there is a risk of blowing up. It's all about settling into a pace you can maintain. If you feel like you have something left at 12, then throw in a surge in that last mile.
It's good to have a plan, but since this is your first half, I think you should just focus on running by feel and just using the watch/clock as a general guide. The crowd at the front isn't going to slow you down that much if you seed yourself appropriately. 13.1 is a great distance because it's short enough to run hard, but long enough that there is a risk of blowing up. It's all about settling into a pace you can maintain. If you feel like you have something left at 12, then throw in a surge in that last mile.
I'm going to agree with all of this. I wish I had seen the thread sooner. I ran my first half last year with like no training. I think my 5k PR at that point was 24ish mins. Averaging maybe 10 miles a week, if that, for about 3 months before the run.
Just run with the people around you. Seed yourself HIGHER than you think you can do. Everyone else does it at these fucking things. At NYC this past spring I put down 1:45 (finished in 1:41) and I was passing motherfuckers for the first mile left and right. At RockAndRoll DC I put 2:00 (my first half) and people were walking after less than a mile.
Seed yourself higher, find what feels like a challenging pace, and let the others around you push you. You will run faster times each mile than you think you could. Drop the watch, focus on your breathing. If you feel like blowing up, make a bargain to try and push it to the next mile. If you make that next mile, you're fine.
I love 13.1 miles. By the end I feel exhausted... but my body isnt trashed.
all this!
a first half is a great thing, just don't over think it! enjoy the experience. just go out and run. when i ran my first half, i ran without ever training with gps, had no idea what my mile splits were, had no idea what i'd be running pace wise, i just ran by feel and it was a great experience.
| Design |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 09/18/14 11:18 AM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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I did the same. First half marathon, stropped to use the restroom trice and ran my last 1.5 miles all-out. Despite the variances it was an awesome experience.
| stickaz_old |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 09/23/14 04:17 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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I did a few jogs here in my taper and played with my GPS watch a bit [the forerunner 210]
avg pace seems to be where its at, with 'lap' settings set to 1.0 miles
I just have to remember to glance at it for the 10s that it shows the last lap pace or simply glance at the net every once in a while for overall pace
avg seems good
I tried 'current lap' which just shows the current lap [I pick 1.0 mile/laps], and I don't think that is terribly useful. Toggling back to the main screen for overall ET/pace and then back during the run doesnt sound like a good idea either
thanks guys
| Ampsman in Extremis |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 09/23/14 06:19 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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You're overthinking it again.
I have a 210 that I use for 90% of my runs, my screen shows total distance, time and avg pace.
Thats all you need boss.
| stickaz_old |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 09/23/14 06:30 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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how is that different than what I posted? I said I'd use avg pace. Oh I get it, I typed a couple addtional words after that.
ib4 still doing it wrong
| Ampsman in Extremis |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 09/23/14 06:45 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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youre talking about toggling and all kinds of shit.
| stickaz_old |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 09/23/14 06:58 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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I was saying that as something I didn't want to do
Quote:
I tried 'current lap' which just shows the current lap [I pick 1.0 mile/laps], and I don't think that is terribly useful. Toggling back to the main screen for overall ET/pace and then back during the run doesnt sound like a good idea either \:D
I get it doe, skinny fat
| SJP0tato |
| (Member) |
| 09/23/14 11:04 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Originally Posted By: stickaz
I tried 'current lap' which just shows the current lap [I pick 1.0 mile/laps], and I don't think that is terribly useful. Toggling back to the main screen for overall ET/pace and then back during the run doesnt sound like a good idea either
I know that feel. It took me a few weeks to figure out which displays I wanted on my 310XT. Turned out 90% of the things I "thought" I wanted to see while running, I actually didn't really care about.
All I have it show now is rotate between total time/distance, and heart-rate/pace (pace is inaccurate enough to be almost worthless, but I haven't bothered replacing it with anything else).
For my upcoming half I'm planning on using the "Virtual Partner" to get a rough idea how close I am to my overall goal pace. I figure that's about the best it's gonna get.
| Cheesegoggles |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 10/04/14 07:06 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Big day tomorrow!
| **DONOTDELETE** |
| () |
| 10/04/14 10:11 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Doooo eeet!
| stickaz_old |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 10/05/14 01:46 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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well, finished, and no walking I guess. I felt pretty good until around mile 10. Avg'd 152-HR for the whole thing so I was trying pretty hard. Just not fit enough to break 2H
2:05:35 chip time, 2:05:01 strava 1/2 time /closeenough
| Sir Ironpool |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 10/05/14 03:32 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Nice job!
| **DONOTDELETE** |
| () |
| 10/05/14 04:33 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Excellent job man.
When's your next one? You'll crack 2 just having done one for real now.
| Cheesegoggles |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 10/05/14 07:07 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Great job!
Going under two hours sounds like it shouldn't be that hard but for those of us who are not genetically gifted it definitely takes some work. You will have no problem getting there next time.
| gamby |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 10/06/14 12:00 AM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Originally Posted By: zakcits
and no walking I guess
God DAMN!!! Good job!!!
| Design |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 10/06/14 12:03 AM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Well done!!!
| stickaz_old |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 10/06/14 12:19 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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thanks guys. I think I'll shoot for the SF 1/2 on 3/29/15
~850' of vert in 3 seperate climbs :scared:, and the golden gate out-n-back
same goal [because I'm stubborn]
2:00:00
gives me 6 months
what I'll try different this time is to be more consistent with a Long-slow-run of ~2 hour duration as this time my legs failed me basically around mile 10. Supposedly training the duration [2h] is really useful for not having this happen again. Who knows /open for thoughts.
Basically I held my goal pace through mile 9 [2h 1/2 pace, 9:09 miles], at miles 10-13 I struggled mightily [held 10:30 miles], so missed by ~5 mins.
After the race, it was hard to walk, I had to grab a handrail to descend a tiny set of 4 stairs lolol
since I'm in the sharing mood: I would be completely stoked if I ever got as 'fast' as say a 1:45 1/2, or even just every mile split starting with an '8'
| Sir Ironpool |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 10/06/14 02:34 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Again, fantastic job for your first go at the distance.
Don't feel bad about not hitting your goal...you fell victim to what just about every rookie does: the wall. Its pretty much just your body not knowing what do with itself once it got past what you'd trained it to do. Your plan of more long runs is def the answer. Run 14-15 miles a handful of times in training and you'll be able to cruise through those last few miles in the race.
FYI, I shaved almost 10 minutes off my first 1/2 in my second attempt and went from not being able to walk after to feeling fantastic in 2 months just by increasing volume.
| Impulsive |
| (Post Master Supreme) |
| 10/06/14 02:43 PM |
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Re: advice sought re: 1/2 marathon [flat] in ~4 months
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Good job man. Although we have a few guys here running crazy distances, a 1/2 marathon is no joke.
I regularly run 7-8 miles, I rarely find it easy.