#74188 - 02/02/05 04:29 AM
Re: what u've all been waiting for, my dyno
|
00Blue
Post Master Sr
Registered: 06/28/02
Posts: 4030
Loc: simi valley CA
|
near identical set up to mine only i was using a vafc p28 combo and hit 179.6 with 120.1. on the same dyno and sean did my tunning and joe did my head work  . good work. upgrade your header and you'll pick up the extra ponies. your header is hurting you. considering your running hondata you should have made more power then me and i'm willing ot bet its your header. try a jdm itr or jdm dc 4-1 i bet you pass 180. i'm about to upgrade to hondata in a week or 2 and re dyno tune so we'll find out 
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#74190 - 02/02/05 08:22 AM
Re: what u've all been waiting for, my dyno
|
s10dude
Newbie
Registered: 02/01/05
Posts: 14
Loc: socal
|
hp basically to the wheels...lmao.......it isd to the wheels/ hubs.........dynapack dyno is one of the best out there plus you can take it everywhere and no tire slipage as you would have on a dyno jet
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#74193 - 02/02/05 03:17 PM
Re: what u've all been waiting for, my dyno
|
SisenoiR
Jr Member
Registered: 12/23/03
Posts: 587
|
NICE!! 
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#74194 - 02/02/05 03:20 PM
Re: what u've all been waiting for, my dyno
|
00Blue
Post Master Sr
Registered: 06/28/02
Posts: 4030
Loc: simi valley CA
|
my dyno goes to 8800. skunk2 stage 1's. its not the cams. its the head work. given proper conditions they don't just hit a brick wall at 8600.
dyno goes to 8800 but you can clearly see it starts to climb slightly again at 8800.
regardless if it levels off it doesn't fall or show signs of falling anytime soon. my guess it it holds steady power well to 9
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#74196 - 02/02/05 04:47 PM
Re: what u've all been waiting for, my dyno
|
strsi
Post Master Jr
Registered: 10/26/04
Posts: 1789
Loc: CA
|
Yea, mine was still climbing very good when it hit 8600. Before the final run (which is what u see) it was climbing even steeper, but since we decided to cut it off at 8600 we worked on midrange power as well. That got me better torque & didn't hurt peak hp.
Yes 00Blue we have almost identical setups, I was actually comparing an old post of ur dyno to mine last night. Shawn did contribute the power at high rpms to the head work done by Joe.
To Vtec2000, my car would of made power well past 8600 if allowed & tuned to do so. On the dyno u see it is still climbing at 8600 & thats after we tuned it for midrange instead. Before we tuned for midrange it was climbing even harder at 8600, but the peak hp was the same. So by tuning for midrange we got more torque & the same peak hp, that did cause it to not climb as steep at 8600, but it doesnt matter right now since im not reving past 8600 anyways. Me & Shawn decided to stop it there cuz reving beyond that will significantly reduce the life of a stock b16 block, so a few more ponnies isn't really worth it.
& to everyone, I know the DC header is hurting me, but it's is smog legal & in CA we have to worry about that shit. I wouldn't care so much if it was any other part, but that is one of the first things cops look @ when u get pulled over. Yes I know my intake is illegal, but I put an AEM sticker & AEM carb sticker on it so I could prob. get away with that in my city. Yes, no cat is illegal as well, but where I live no cop is going to look under ur car for a cat. So basically, I'm making a good amount of power on a engine that wont get me sent to the smog ref. everytime I get pulled over.
One day I might upgrade to a comptech (which is smog leagl as well) or maybe even a JDM ITR, but for now, the DC works just fine.
Thank u for the complements everyone! I'll keep u updated.
_________________________
2000 EBP Si 181.5whp, 119wtq- All Motor B16
1994 EG Hatch
2000 BMW 328ci
207 Forever- RIP
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#74197 - 02/03/05 12:20 AM
Re: what u've all been waiting for, my dyno
|
00Blue
Post Master Sr
Registered: 06/28/02
Posts: 4030
Loc: simi valley CA
|
why don't you just take the smog legal plate off your dc gay 2 1 and weld it on a jdm dc 4-1. cops would never know.
< thats what i did.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#74198 - 02/03/05 03:28 AM
Re: what u've all been waiting for, my dyno
|
strsi
Post Master Jr
Registered: 10/26/04
Posts: 1789
Loc: CA
|
We were all young & dumb at some point in time, if buying a DC header is the worst thing I did then I can live with that.
I am working towards a JDM ITR, I just need more money now. & I need to save up a little bit of money to for other shit, but I'll eventually get the JDM. Ur switching the plate idea is good, I was also thinking that I could just get the upper heat shield & put it on, then it will just look like a stock exhaust manifold to cops.
Only thing is, if I get the JDM then I need a new cat. & I'm thinking I'll stop risking it & actually put on a cat. So there goes more money. Hopefully it makes more power cuz it will be -
Before- DC header w/ no cat & After- JDM header w/ high flow cat
so i dont know if it will really make much more power, but hell, at least I wont have to worry about the $2000 ticket or whatever huge amount it is for not having a cat.
Edited by strsi (02/03/05 04:08 AM)
_________________________
2000 EBP Si 181.5whp, 119wtq- All Motor B16
1994 EG Hatch
2000 BMW 328ci
207 Forever- RIP
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#74199 - 02/03/05 09:26 AM
Re: what u've all been waiting for, my dyno
|
00Blue
Post Master Sr
Registered: 06/28/02
Posts: 4030
Loc: simi valley CA
|
ya. whatever you do. run a high flow cat so if a cop looks under there he see's something. cuz it is a 2000 dollar ticket for no cat and immediate impounding of your car on the spot.
jdm dc-4-1 with the smog plate from a carb legal dc works perfectly. as i have a dc 4-2-1 that i did that with. told ya our set ups were almost the same lol i even had the header you have now
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#74200 - 02/03/05 09:32 AM
Re: what u've all been waiting for, my dyno
|
cruzersi99
Post Master
Registered: 11/13/99
Posts: 2513
|
looks pretty good. Congratulations. Like everyone mentioned your header is hurting you along with your exhaust. Replace those and your power won't dip as much, and may even climb. Technically as is your not making power past 7500 rpms. Your torque curve is dropping. Your HP is only increasing because of revs.
_________________________
186 whp - Church Automotive (Dynapack) 189 whp - Zero Factory (Bosch) 
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#74203 - 02/03/05 02:18 PM
Re: what u've all been waiting for, my dyno
|
RGarramone
Jr Poster
Registered: 12/24/04
Posts: 95
Loc: NY. USA
|
is it me or are these numbers totally underachieving. i have a 2000 si and when i bought it it was completely stock and i put almost 150 to the wheels (actually 149.8). when i put simple mods on it (i/e/h) i reached 155 whp. now im planning to do head work, valve train, engine mangament and am expecting 200 whp from others setups. if you actually have all those mods on your b16 your tuner sux, u should esily be hitting 200 whp
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#74205 - 02/03/05 08:51 PM
Re: what u've all been waiting for, my dyno
|
strsi
Post Master Jr
Registered: 10/26/04
Posts: 1789
Loc: CA
|
Quote:
is it me or are these numbers totally underachieving. i have a 2000 si and when i bought it it was completely stock and i put almost 150 to the wheels (actually 149.8). when i put simple mods on it (i/e/h) i reached 155 whp. now im planning to do head work, valve train, engine mangament and am expecting 200 whp from others setups. if you actually have all those mods on your b16 your tuner sux, u should esily be hitting 200 whp
u r one stupid mother fucker.  Like said, 200whp is hard as hell to get out of a b16, especially with a stock block & stage1 cams. Yea, any Si will put out about 150whp with bolt ons, thats the easy shit, but once u do that & cams then it is hard as hell & expensive to gain more hp in an NA setup. 200whp is considered a great achievement out of a b18 NA, & is very rare to see on an NA b16. Especially with only 91 octaine gas. & if u dont know, Shawn Church is considered to be one of the top 2 tuners in SoCal (it's between him & Bubba, just depends who u talk to), & we all know that CA has the best tuners around.
Tell u what, go ahead & build ur motor, I bet u wont even get close to 200.
_________________________
2000 EBP Si 181.5whp, 119wtq- All Motor B16
1994 EG Hatch
2000 BMW 328ci
207 Forever- RIP
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#74206 - 02/03/05 09:38 PM
Re: what u've all been waiting for, my dyno
|
RGarramone
Jr Poster
Registered: 12/24/04
Posts: 95
Loc: NY. USA
|
first of all im not from "socal" so no i dont know who "shawn church" is.
secondly i know about 2 or 3 people who have b16 with stock bottom ends and have easily hit 200 whp and are planning for more without foorced induction. im from ny so if your "one of top 2 tuners in socal" can only squeeze 177 out of that thing with those mods then its a sad day for "socal" and your entire area is total hype and way overrated and talked about.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#74207 - 02/03/05 10:01 PM
Re: what u've all been waiting for, my dyno
|
00Blue
Post Master Sr
Registered: 06/28/02
Posts: 4030
Loc: simi valley CA
|
max whp means nothing. you could have a car with 170 whp get fucking obliterated by a car with 145 whp. its all power band. and if you notice your dyno vs mine or his. our 30 more whp then yours at max isn't the only diff. the entire power band makes power sooner and through out a longer period. people that base things on peak numbers are fucking idiots.
take my dyno for example. my car makes your car's max power at 6000 rpm and climbs far ahead of it all the way to 9. where as your car probably makes around 120 at 6000 and only hits 150 for the last 500 rpm or so.
edit: you can't hit 200 whp on a n/a b16 with stage 1 cams. so i don't care what you've heard. your friends are lying to you or the dyno you guys use is a pos. find one that isn't calibrated to make 20 more whp then you really have
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#74208 - 02/03/05 10:41 PM
Re: what u've all been waiting for, my dyno
|
RGarramone
Jr Poster
Registered: 12/24/04
Posts: 95
Loc: NY. USA
|
considering i havent told you any specs about any cars ive been accustomed with ur the one who sounds like an idiot talking about things that youve never seen or heard about. who said ne thing about stage one cams and when have you ever seen any dyno sheet of mine or anybbody that i know. you are what most people call dillusional. you make up facts or quotes for lack of a better word that have not been presented to you and just make a positive case for your argument. keep talking ive seen the dyno and im telling you from first hand expierence as a primary resource that i do know of 200 whp stock block si's, i have driven them and know what i am talking about. considering i am a mechanical engineering major i know what the fuck i am talking about i go to school for this shit so dont question my intelligence or my mechanical inclination. just because me and my boys can produce better cars than you "socal" wussbags dont feel bad there is still a future for you. there is always jiffylube or the local autoparts store. 
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#74209 - 02/03/05 10:51 PM
Re: what u've all been waiting for, my dyno
|
00Blue
Post Master Sr
Registered: 06/28/02
Posts: 4030
Loc: simi valley CA
|
you stated... if you actually have all those mods and only hit those numbers your tuner sucks. he has stage 1 cams. its impossible to get much higher numbers with stage 1 cams. so exactly what point have you proven. and as you said. you hit 155 with i/h/e. 5 whp with those 3 mods, so thinking your going to get 45 more whp on the stock block. is maybe possible. but doubtful. you need above 11:1 compression which with a stock block would require you to mill the head to achieve the comp. and in that case your limited to what cams you can run because of clearance issues. 200 whp stock block = next to impossible. 200 whp with pistons is hard but alot easier. with the compression you would need to do it you couldn't clear the cams required to do it.
now stop arguing and take your i've seen this my buddy has this crap somewhere else. either post a dyno/set up or shut up.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#74210 - 02/03/05 11:42 PM
Re: what u've all been waiting for, my dyno
|
RGarramone
Jr Poster
Registered: 12/24/04
Posts: 95
Loc: NY. USA
|
considering it wasnt my car on the dyno i do not have a dyno sheet. and again you dont know what m or anyother person i kow have done to their cars so you are still talking about thing you have no idea about. all i said in the beginning was that 177 whp was a under what i expected out of thise mods he listed from my own expierence, not from what you stated earlier which again i never said"now stop arguing and take your i've seen this my buddy has this crap somewhere else" ive worked ont these cars and know them inside and out. all you "socal" jerk offs freaked out like i just screwed your mothers or something. maybe you should learn how to communicate in a reasonable and competent way and then you wont get in a dick measuring match with someone you ignoranat assholes. you think that your all high and mighty because under your handle name addresses you as a "post master sr" unfortunatly i dont take tremendous amouts of pride in that title i just post on here because id like to hear opinions from other honda tuners. now if your unevolved brains cannot comprehend the fractional possiblilty that maybe your not the greatest honda tuners in the world then maybe you'll grasp what the real world is about. there will always be someone looking over your shoulder who is better than you. and as for you ealier comment of basically its impossible to reach 200 who on a stock block, i feel sorry for you. nothing is impossible
Impossible is just a big word thrown around by small men who find it easier to live in the world they've been given than to explore the power they have to change it. Impossible is not a fact. It's an opinion. Impossible is not a declaration. It's a dare. Impossible is potential. Impossible is temporary. Impossible is nothing.
i mean god dammit it you people are so eager to jump down some ones throat if a new idea or something beyond your range of comprehension is brought up. next time you hear an opinion (which was in fact my first reply in this post and opinon if curiosity) let it swirl around in your heads for a little while insyead of just predeterminetly saying basically "fuck you you fucking moron" it like the only people who are allowed to accomplish anything are yourselves. maybe you consider that fact that there are people in this world who may know a little more than you and wither accept it or you yourselves work harder.
next time be a liitle more accepting of another persons opinions, ideas ot thoughts and you wont get into a pissing match
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#74211 - 02/03/05 11:56 PM
Re: what u've all been waiting for, my dyno
|
strsi
Post Master Jr
Registered: 10/26/04
Posts: 1789
Loc: CA
|
RGarramone, u got to be fucking kidding me. Ur the same guy who thinks spoon cams are the greatest thing in the world. If ur so fucking smart then u would realize that the difference in lift & durration between them & the s2s1's is so minimal that they wont make almost any difference in power.
So let me get this right, ur gonna do head & valvetrain work on ur b16 & that's gonna give u over 200whp? & in another post u said u wanted to use spoon cams but 00blue may have talked u into s2s1's in that thread. So with bolt-ons & headwork & either spoon or s2s1 cams ur gonna make 200whp? Dam, Id love to see that happen, if u could make that happen, then ud be the best engine builder around.
& like 00blue said, the only way u could make 200whp with a b16 is with some huge CR. & the only way to do that without touching the block is to mill the shit out of the head. & if u did that then u wouldnt even be able to run cams able to get u up to 200 because of clearance issues. And if even if u make more hp then me it will be because ur car was tuned to be a dyno queen, which means I'd still smoke u in a race cuz my car is tuned to make power where it counts, all through the power band.
So what u need to do is shut the fuck up. U really think u can make it happen, then prove it. Do the work & post ur dyno, put up or shut up. We really dont fucking care about ur "friends" cars.
_________________________
2000 EBP Si 181.5whp, 119wtq- All Motor B16
1994 EG Hatch
2000 BMW 328ci
207 Forever- RIP
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#74213 - 02/04/05 11:30 AM
Re: what u've all been waiting for, my dyno
|
s10dude
Newbie
Registered: 02/01/05
Posts: 14
Loc: socal
|
the dude from NY needs to STFU and sit down and learn.......b16 can really only handle about 200whp and still be reliable......if you want higher numbers u would need to get a new bottom end(preferablly b18 sleeved and bored to a b20 displacment). Alaniz is top notch shit......Churches automotive uses the dynapack and he is a damn good tuner...
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#74214 - 02/04/05 11:51 AM
Re: what u've all been waiting for, my dyno
|
RGarramone
Jr Poster
Registered: 12/24/04
Posts: 95
Loc: NY. USA
|
ill say it again for a third or maybe even fourth time. i never said anything about what mods i or anyone i know has. i never mentioned skunk 2 satge whatevers or what work was done to any part of any part of the car. whats amazing is that all of you are so critcal and trapped in your own world that you cant except the fact that something has been done that you cant achieve. and like s10duse said "b16 can really only handle 200whp and still be reliable". thats all im saying. it is possible to get 200 whp out of a b16. and another thing, i never said anything about powerbands and where in the rpm range you guys or anybody is making power, all im saying is that a b16 can put 200whp to the wheels. you people are so close minded and think that your the greatest mechanics in the world. its unbelieveable that you can just accept that it has been done, im done with this post, you people are most likely the biggest assholes and most iggnorant and stubborn people i have ever come in contact with. if you are so close minded that you think that if you "socal" dickheads cant accomplish something it cant be done i have pity for you and i hope you are atlest book smart because your people skills are worth absolutly nothing. i feel sorry for all of you
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#74215 - 02/04/05 03:16 PM
Re: what u've all been waiting for, my dyno
|
00Blue
Post Master Sr
Registered: 06/28/02
Posts: 4030
Loc: simi valley CA
|
lol your awesome. your giving the run around with words because we proved you wrong. i said next to impossible. and if you touch the block its 1000x easier. i'm saying with the a stock block i'd be willing to bet it won't happen. and in my earlier post i explained why. and if you can't argue with that. if you notice i never posted hostile towards you so you can stop now. if you want to have a serious debate why not post in a civilized manner instead of throwing socal jerk this socal jerk that around when i never was hostile to you. you make yourself sound like some 17 year old nut swinger who's upset cuz he doesn't know as much as he thought he did. i'm done with this post and its a shame cuz it started out nice and you made it so it should be locked. this kind of arguing shouldn't happen on forums and should be taken to pm. even in that case its not nessesary. its not hard to have intellegent conversation instead of coming into someones post and saying your dyno tunner sucks cuz blah blah blah...
_________________________
"it's a honda.. A/C is like a kill switch"
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#74218 - 02/04/05 11:26 PM
Re: what u've all been waiting for, my dyno
|
cruzersi99
Post Master
Registered: 11/13/99
Posts: 2513
|
Quote:
Quote:
looks pretty good. Congratulations. Like everyone mentioned your header is hurting you along with your exhaust.
So how again is a N1 exhaust hurting my power? It's a straight through canister, u can't really get anything that flows better then that. Well, except for no muffler at all, but yea that would be a little loud.
When I said exhaust I was talking more about your whole exhaust system beginning to end. Mainly get some coordination between header collector size, cat size, and exhaust tubing size.
I was never a fan of the N1 for sound reasons so i can speak to how consistent it is. at the bends and at the resonators..
Good luck with the build up.
BTW - 200 whp out of a a stock bottom end would need one hell of a generous dyno, and would kill the powerband. Omniman spent hundreds of hours to get his b16 over 200whp, on two different and well known dynos. His setup required the perfect combination of parts, and tons of tuning. Even his setup required the use of of higher compression jdm pistons.
I put down 189 on Shawn's dyno, and I don't think that me switching to a stage II cam would even get me to 200whp.
_________________________
186 whp - Church Automotive (Dynapack) 189 whp - Zero Factory (Bosch)
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#74219 - 02/05/05 12:08 AM
Re: what u've all been waiting for, my dyno
|
00Blue
Post Master Sr
Registered: 06/28/02
Posts: 4030
Loc: simi valley CA
|
189 for the parts your running is amazing and seans dyno is pretty generous considering its a dyno pack. i'd wager that a real dyno with the wheels on not to the hubs would be about 5 whp less then a dyno pack. maybe more. 200 is not very likely on a stock block is the only point we were tryin to make.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#74220 - 02/05/05 01:35 AM
Re: what u've all been waiting for, my dyno
|
strsi
Post Master Jr
Registered: 10/26/04
Posts: 1789
Loc: CA
|
Quote:
When I said exhaust I was talking more about your whole exhaust system beginning to end. Mainly get some coordination between header collector size, cat size, and exhaust tubing size.
I'm still not really understanding u on this. My header collector is 2.25", my race cat is 2.25", & my N1 is 60mm or just over 2.25". So how am I not coordinating them? Yes, I understand the DC header isn't the greatest, I'm planning to upgrade it eventually & the cat as well, I just don't have the $ right now.
Quote:
I put down 189 on Shawn's dyno, and I don't think that me switching to a stage II cam would even get me to 200whp.
Very impressive, do u mind giving a quick run off of the mods u have & what motor this is on? I'm just trying to get a lot of feedback on other peoples setups who are making close to 200whp N/A.
& yes I read about Omniman's b16 buildup to make over 200whp. Dam that was amazing. But that just goes to prove our point that 200whp is one hell of an achievement out of a b16, he had to use jdm pistons though. That other guy  , whatever his name is, was trying to say that he could do it without even touching the block, yea I'd love to see that happen.
_________________________
2000 EBP Si 181.5whp, 119wtq- All Motor B16
1994 EG Hatch
2000 BMW 328ci
207 Forever- RIP
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
Moderator: Runnin@Redline Jr, Dr. BrokenLimits, Professor Paki
|
|
?
